Sup sup ya’ll….I’ve been wanting to touch this topic for quite some time now. As the initial feelings of “Finding Forever” have somewhat subdued, it will also follow the ritual process of being archived, but not forgotten, like the rest of my Common albums. As I have been known to be wordy, I will just get straight to the point. If it is not known already, I am a big Common fan, for a myriad of reasons that I will not get into at this present time. I want to examine a couple of lines that Common has dropped over the years and use those as examples to prove my thesis that Common’s commercial success, or lack thereof, has been a direct result of his lyrics and his inability to make music that ALL people can relate to. Some may find the latter statement inaccurate since he just made a track entitled, “The People.” However, in all fairness, I think the track should’ve actually been called, “Black People.” I bring this topic up only to strike certain levels of discourse and debate and not to shed any hate on Common, who I have a great deal of respect for. But, in many respects, I gotta call a spade a spade.
My lady mentioned to me quite some time ago that a white guy who she used to go to school with is big on hip-hop…During a conversation about Common, he mentions that he thinks Common is okay but he’s a racist and he can’t get down with his music. The dude felt that Common saying he’s for “the people” is ludicrous. When she told me that, I was like, “Comm’s not racist.” I still do not think he’s racist but I can’t say that I do not understand where the bul was coming from.
Amidst Comm’s prolific verse-catalogue, he’ll drop lines like:
1. “While white folk focus on dogs and yoga, my people on the low end try to ball and get ova”
2. “Black men walking wit white girls on they arms, I be mad at em as if I know they moms. Told to go beyond the surface, a person’s a person. When we lessen our women our condition seems to worsen.”
3. “Some say that God is Black and the Devil’s White. Well, the Devil is wrong and God is what’s right”
I’m sure there are countless other bars but I do not think it’s accruate to say that Common’s racist. I do think that he’s somewhat marginalized a large pool of consumers who would have supported him despite lines that seem to call them out. Common has always been revolutionary and freedom rap but can in the true spirit of revolutionary and freedom, it really doesn’t make a lot of sense or rather, it seems counterproductive to speak ill about white people.
I’m not too sure if there’s audio out there about Common speaking about said topic but I’d love to hear his thoughts about him making tracks like “The People” but still have this itch when it comes to white people. I want to also express that I am not saying that Common should necessarily curry favor to the white audience. I think he’s an artist and needs to stay in a zone that in comfortable and consistent for him. What I am intrigued to find out is do you think Common has marginalized himself by his lyrics to lose the “white” consumer’s dollar? Do you think that white people are even checking him out like that? If so, do you think they recognize such lyrics. In the example of the dude above, he recognized it and as a result, does not support Common.
What’re your thoughts?
~Thesis
Reecie
thehonorable
Its funny b/c one of my good friends from college is white and I would not understand when he would say an artist was racist but now i am little bit more sensitive to lyrics that we as blacks may not even think twice about. For example, I was going to send him the link to the new TalibK and a few lyrics in song made me change my plans b/c it would not be a good look. But I think it works both ways, there are lyrics or comments that we (AA) may consider racist and whites-americans do not think twice about it and there are comments that they perceive racist that we do not think twice about it. However, I do not believe being conscious or having cultural pride requires downing another race however, being conscious requires moving towards positive change within your race, nationality etc.
“Drug dealer by Jordan, crackhead by crack, and the white man get paid offa alla that.”
His boss must be racist too, but I still see more white people at their concerts than ever.
I don’t really think he’s speaking ill, more like he’s speaking honestly. I think people who “understand” the plight of black people will not think that Common is a racist, but recognize that he is speaking out for the group that always seems to be underrepresented in every faction. This guy is looking at singular lines, not at everything. He is also someone who also seems very ignorant of the realities of this world and is so focused on three phrases from one song.
That being said, he had all those white folks at the concert I went to with their fists in the air during this song so if they like it, I love it!
reen,
Playing the dev advocate, you know we do not hear a singular line and justify by saying that we did not hear the everything. However, I do not think Common is racist. But the group my friend would complain about all the time was “Dead Prez”
*justify it by saying that we did not hear everything.
Dead Prez definitely does not make music for a white audience. I guess if they like it, that’s fine, but they are really not interested in pleasing that group of listeners. I think it’s dumb to take one bar out of the context of an entire song, that’s all I’m saying. It’s like someone saying “Sometimes I hate when white people don’t take issues regarding black people seriously,” and someone writing “Sometimes I hate…white people…” You just can’t do that. I mean you can lol, but you shouldn’t.
reen,
I definitely agree with you I just wanted to play the other side for conversation. However, Dead Prez does not make music for me either because I disagree with many of there views. I just think a lot of militant blacks (as well as other militant racial motivated groups) confuse progressing toward positive change with racist because it is easy. I see it too many times where decently smart individuals read a few books about slavery, civil rights etc and believe it gives them the right to hate all people that do not align themselves with their beliefs and the individual is brainwashed by the system (aka the white man).
See, i admire Common too much and so does my wife, and in our eyes, he enters a genre we call “REAL/TRUE Hip-Hop”… along wit Talib Kweli, Mos Def, Dead Prez and much more…
And what they tend to do is try glorify black ppl by empathizin wot theyv gon thru n how theyv stood strong….
My wife, however, says that the only problem is if ur gona glorify a race… no matter how u do it… wether its thru materalisim (what modern rappers tend to do) or thru glorifyin the struggle… ur marginlizin them… ur sayin… “Blk ppl r diffrent” and ur therefore creatin barriers!
i respect common for not changing his views on a record for the acceptance of white listeners… thats what i would call “selling out.” as an artist, i feel he has a responsibility to himself to make music that reflects what he really feels… im sure he has had the opportunities to make music more geared toward all audiences and props to him for not changing in fear of what people might think (whether or not i always agree w/ what he’s saying).
and about dead prez… i think that people who label them as racist arent listening to what theyre saying. now i will admit that i havent heard their material outside of Let’s Get Free, but thats one of my favorite albums and i have yet to come across a line that says they outright hate white people. some views that they project towards all white people seem kind of harsh, but until this country stops projecting their views of blacks towards all blacks, i cant say that what theyre doing is wrong of them, especially if it’s just history. ive heard interviews w/ them saying that they dont mind white people feeling their music and performing in front of mostly white crowds as long as people are *actually* down for their cause. their message has never come across (to me, at least) as anti-white, but instead as pro-black and even more as a political/socialist movement. and if there is no such thing as blackness w/o whiteness (and vice versa), how would you expect them not to mention whites and, given the history of our country, in a mostly negative light?
the idea of getting black artists to always cater to white listeners takes away from a genre that can be used to uplift a people who really need it right now.
People are bigots. Institutions are racist. Common is an employee. Common isn’t putting out music that isn’t approved by Geffen
His record company has no problem with his lyrics, so what’s the issue.
Not talking about Bitches, Hoes , and Drugs limits his commercial success. What’s worse dislike of white folks or killing your own kind on wax. Why aren’t we talking about that?
i think the second quote you used contributes to comm no being racist
“told to go beyond the surface, a persons a person”
a lot of things limit his success - mainly his focus on reality- most people use music to escape it, he tries to use it to change ones reality, most use music to avoid life and fantasize
so yeah, its kinda like church, everyone should go, but not everyone feels that way
so you cant reach everyone when you really believe in something unless you mix it all in i.e kanye
I was reading about Common and Wikipedia and according to it he has been in trouble for his lyrics to the point where people accuse him of being racist and againt things like black and white people dating. I guess the general public are just ignoring the lyrics and not taking it to seriously. After all kanye West said something that you could take as racist but not many people do. If a country artist or a white artist said something similar than it would cause a big storm.
donjusuton I understand what you are saying however I just disagree.
the comment
“but until this country stops projecting their views of blacks towards all blacks, i cant say that what theyre doing is wrong of them.”
I think some of this is human nature however I think this is not limited to blacks nor is it limited to this country. If I say write the first thing you think of when I say “Mexican Immigrant”, Jew, Gay male or Asian. Unless you know many of each category (as in friends not work with), the first thing many people think of are stereotypical representations. So, I do not think of it as a “this country” issue, it is a human issue because it is easy. In addition “this country” to me is code for “white people” because “this country” should include blacks, latins, asians and natives due to all cultures having influence on what others around the world consider “this country” to be and the influence we have on where “this country” is going.
Just by saying “record for the acceptance of white listeners” suggest that white listeners can not and do not have the same views on life or the struggles and/or successes as black listeners. 2nd, Personally I think being pro-black or whatever you want to call it should be a movement of the future not a concentration on the past. We learn from the past so we will not repeat past ills however I think it can be distraction and counter productive if the majority of our mindshare is focused on past.
Last week I was having a discussion with my family about something someone else said, however to the point, I actually hate when we marginalize each other, within our own race. Personally, I think it worse than when others marginalize us because I expect it from others because as i said, it is a human issue and human nature. Example: I heard someone say “black people dont like tiger woods” or someone saying “Oprah isnt black enough”. I do not think any person has the right to define what is black because being black is not a monolith, neither i being white, hispanic, asian or any race, nationality or culture.
Just my opinion however i have never been a cynic when discussing these issues.
Mo-
“My wife, however, says that the only problem is if ur gona glorify a race… no matter how u do it… wether its thru materalisim (what modern rappers tend to do) or thru glorifyin the struggle… ur marginlizin them… ur sayin… “Blk ppl r diffrent” and ur therefore creatin barriers!”
Your otha half brings up a great point. I’d like to cast this next question at you, however. Do you think that there are many artists who’ve stayed true to themselves and their culture/community but have still been accepted in the mainstream?
I think Jay-Z would fall into that category. What do you think?
BigSwa-
“Not talking about Bitches, Hoes , and Drugs limits his commercial success”
I think you missed the point I was trying to make brethren.
Reen-
“That being said, he had all those white folks at the concert I went to with their fists in the air during this song so if they like it, I love it!”
lol..
More white people buy Common and concsious albums than black people. Most people would be shocked to find out the small percentile of black people who actually buy albums.
The question isn’t does Common limit his commercial success rather is his commercial success limited by his content? The answer to that is obviously yes. Common is one of the few folks out there with artistic integrity…he writes and raps about what he believes, and what he stands for…not to be the winner of a popularity contest. Complex music is harder to sell than leaning and snapping or whatever kind brainless music is out there…however, he strives to make music that is timeless and that requires a different skill than making music that sells.
Anyone that says Common is racist is a moron. Just because someone is uncomfortable with Common’s views, that doesn’t make him a racist. If that person understood Common’s lyrics in a historical context and went below the surface then he wouldn’t make such an ignorant statement.
Although Common touches on a lot of issues that are especially pertinent to black folks…he also touches on universal issues such as love, family, being a positive person, changing the community etc.
To Thesis….
Hmmm interesting question… In my eyes, I think its quite hard to stay true AND at the same time become mainstream… fair enough there are exceptions but u wil tend to find that the majority are not capable, this is due to the fact that commercialism can change you and the points you try to put across in your songs.
I do agree with you about Jay-Z, at first my wife said that she doesn’t agree, but I expanded the following way… Jay-z, fair enough, he raps about girls, money, cars, hustling and at the moment… the wealthy life etc. But what makes him different, is the fact that from the beginning he has been like this. Ok, so has 50 Cent (who I might add, I hate… lol) but the difference between both, is that 50 caters to what will make him get rich, as Jay-Z raps and produces with his heart in his work. My wife then understood what I was sayin and explained it simply… “Jay-Z started with a certain ‘Swagga’ and has maintained it.”
You then have other MCs such as Nas, who I must admit, in both our eyes (im talking about my wife), was trying too hard to show that he was Ghetto, or so… but thru bein mainstream, he has changed in the opposite direction, where now he has matured and becom mor soulful and true to Hip-Hop.
Any artist willing to stay true to themselves and not compromise their message will try to stay low and stay away from the mainstream, an example being Immortal Technique… the only problem though, is that by staying underground, not many people will hear your message. So by broadcasting your message (turning to the mainstream audience), you “try to stay true” so that the media doesn’t change you… therefore transforming what used to come natural without thinking twice into something consciously done.
Well… that’s what I think… what are your opinions?
O ye, and back onto the Jay-Z issue, 1 of the main lines I can alwyz jump at, backing up that he is true, is the following:
“First I snatched the streets // Then I snatch the charts // First I had their ear // Now I have their heart
Rappers came and went // I’ve Been Here From the start // I seen them put it together // Watched them take it apart”
HOLD UP! Im sorry if i make some of yall upset but yall have to be out of your minds for actually tryin to make this situation seem unracist and dumb as hell. 1st of, im white, and i have absolutely no problem with any race out there, second, who the hell are u to tell what color the god and the devil are, even if god is black, who the hell says the devil is white, wtf! I mean this upsets me, especially when he criticized black men bein wit white girls, that type of dumb ass comment isnt what the world needs to hear.
Bottom line, ive never ever liked common at all, his raps are way too liberal and overhyped, and bottom line, he can go F%$# himself!
Does Common have a commercial audience in mind when he makes an album, I mean look at the current state of commercial rap its “Crossed Over” so much its now pop
hey.. thank you man